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	<title>Comments on: Consciencebound to Leave the Faith: My Conversion and De-Conversion Story</title>
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	<link>http://consciencebound.com/2008/01/09/my-conversion-and-de-conversion-story/</link>
	<description>...  to Leave the Faith</description>
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		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://consciencebound.com/2008/01/09/my-conversion-and-de-conversion-story/comment-page-1/#comment-767</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jun 2009 14:21:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://consciencebound.com/?p=179#comment-767</guid>
		<description>I couldn&#039;t agree more Brian.  That was a big part of the unraveling of my own faith.  Watching myself and others argue in that way with other religions.  Always thinking that by holy book was exempt from criticism while I wasted no time in pointing out the short comings of the Koran and Book of Mormon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I couldn&#8217;t agree more Brian.  That was a big part of the unraveling of my own faith.  Watching myself and others argue in that way with other religions.  Always thinking that by holy book was exempt from criticism while I wasted no time in pointing out the short comings of the Koran and Book of Mormon.</p>
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		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://consciencebound.com/2008/01/09/my-conversion-and-de-conversion-story/comment-page-1/#comment-766</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jun 2009 13:41:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://consciencebound.com/?p=179#comment-766</guid>
		<description>Jeff,

I remember participating in a Bible study back when I first became a Christian and the topic was how do we preach the gospel to people of other faiths and encourage them to convert to our own.  How would you go about converting a Mulsim, a Mormon, a Jew, etc.  And not one person had a single idea that made sense.  Mind you, these were all seasoned Christians, people who had been practicing and renewing their faith for years, including the pastor of the church.  The best anyone could come up with was, &quot;Well, but OUR god is alive&quot; and (when speaking to the Mormons) &quot;Your religion is just a cult.&quot;  It all ended up sounding like, as George Carlin used to say, &quot;My god has a bigger d--- than your god.&quot;  

Even now as Christians try and convince deconverts why they&#039;re wrong, they do nothing to make us see that THEIR way is the right way.  Anything they say could just as easily be preached at us by a Muslim, a Buddhist, a Wiccan.  It&#039;s not simply a matter of Pascal&#039;s Wager is it?  Sure I&#039;ll take the wager, but why should I wager on YOUR god anymore than that guy&#039;s god?

Great post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jeff,</p>
<p>I remember participating in a Bible study back when I first became a Christian and the topic was how do we preach the gospel to people of other faiths and encourage them to convert to our own.  How would you go about converting a Mulsim, a Mormon, a Jew, etc.  And not one person had a single idea that made sense.  Mind you, these were all seasoned Christians, people who had been practicing and renewing their faith for years, including the pastor of the church.  The best anyone could come up with was, &#8220;Well, but OUR god is alive&#8221; and (when speaking to the Mormons) &#8220;Your religion is just a cult.&#8221;  It all ended up sounding like, as George Carlin used to say, &#8220;My god has a bigger d&#8212; than your god.&#8221;  </p>
<p>Even now as Christians try and convince deconverts why they&#8217;re wrong, they do nothing to make us see that THEIR way is the right way.  Anything they say could just as easily be preached at us by a Muslim, a Buddhist, a Wiccan.  It&#8217;s not simply a matter of Pascal&#8217;s Wager is it?  Sure I&#8217;ll take the wager, but why should I wager on YOUR god anymore than that guy&#8217;s god?</p>
<p>Great post.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://consciencebound.com/2008/01/09/my-conversion-and-de-conversion-story/comment-page-1/#comment-756</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:42:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://consciencebound.com/?p=179#comment-756</guid>
		<description>Tex,
I don&#039;t consider myself better than God or anyone else for that matter.  I feel that my change in beliefs was not something that I chose per se, but was rather what I honestly see as the truth.  I am however totally open to the truth wherever it may lead, even if it leads me back to Christianity.  I guess I don&#039;t see how that is stabbing the lord in the back.  He is more than welcome to reveal himself to me and anyone else anytime he would like to.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tex,<br />
I don&#8217;t consider myself better than God or anyone else for that matter.  I feel that my change in beliefs was not something that I chose per se, but was rather what I honestly see as the truth.  I am however totally open to the truth wherever it may lead, even if it leads me back to Christianity.  I guess I don&#8217;t see how that is stabbing the lord in the back.  He is more than welcome to reveal himself to me and anyone else anytime he would like to.</p>
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		<title>By: Tex</title>
		<link>http://consciencebound.com/2008/01/09/my-conversion-and-de-conversion-story/comment-page-1/#comment-749</link>
		<dc:creator>Tex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Jun 2009 13:48:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://consciencebound.com/?p=179#comment-749</guid>
		<description>Tex: The Lord changed your life, now you think you are better than God.

It&#039;s funny how you don&#039;t return to the drugs and alcohol life.

How can you stab The Lord in the back this way and sleep at night?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tex: The Lord changed your life, now you think you are better than God.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s funny how you don&#8217;t return to the drugs and alcohol life.</p>
<p>How can you stab The Lord in the back this way and sleep at night?</p>
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		<title>By: Bible Verses</title>
		<link>http://consciencebound.com/2008/01/09/my-conversion-and-de-conversion-story/comment-page-1/#comment-429</link>
		<dc:creator>Bible Verses</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Nov 2008 01:37:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://consciencebound.com/?p=179#comment-429</guid>
		<description>Superior post.Keep up the smashing work,You should definitely have to keep updating your site</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Superior post.Keep up the smashing work,You should definitely have to keep updating your site</p>
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		<title>By: mike3</title>
		<link>http://consciencebound.com/2008/01/09/my-conversion-and-de-conversion-story/comment-page-1/#comment-74</link>
		<dc:creator>mike3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:42:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://consciencebound.com/?p=179#comment-74</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t think Christianity was a good religion either, at least not any more. It was for it&#039;s time (like 1500 years or more ago), but the light has gone from it now.

However, I don&#039;t believe that either faith or intellect should triumph over each other, but rather be balanced, with the two complementing and moderating each other.

For one thing, I was never raised with Christianity, and I have no desire to convert to it, knowing that the light is gone.

Also, even if something is not consistent with our knowledge does not mean it is wrong as our knowledge is not free of error. What it means is that we have to test it, test _both_ in fact, test the claim that is not consistent, and test whether or not what we percieved as our &quot;knowledge&quot; in the area was actually right.

Religion and reason should not be mutually opposing forces, but instead mutually complementary forces. The best way I have heard to describe this is to liken the two to the wings of a bird, of which both are needed to fly and with only one no flight is possible. Religion without reason leads to superstition (like believing that some ritual you do saves your bacon or that the world was made 6000 years ago or that Jesus really did actually rise up in his body or similar) and reason without religion leads to materialism (like believing that material things, money, sex, etc. are the ways to true happiness when they are in fact not such at all.).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t think Christianity was a good religion either, at least not any more. It was for it&#8217;s time (like 1500 years or more ago), but the light has gone from it now.</p>
<p>However, I don&#8217;t believe that either faith or intellect should triumph over each other, but rather be balanced, with the two complementing and moderating each other.</p>
<p>For one thing, I was never raised with Christianity, and I have no desire to convert to it, knowing that the light is gone.</p>
<p>Also, even if something is not consistent with our knowledge does not mean it is wrong as our knowledge is not free of error. What it means is that we have to test it, test _both_ in fact, test the claim that is not consistent, and test whether or not what we percieved as our &#8220;knowledge&#8221; in the area was actually right.</p>
<p>Religion and reason should not be mutually opposing forces, but instead mutually complementary forces. The best way I have heard to describe this is to liken the two to the wings of a bird, of which both are needed to fly and with only one no flight is possible. Religion without reason leads to superstition (like believing that some ritual you do saves your bacon or that the world was made 6000 years ago or that Jesus really did actually rise up in his body or similar) and reason without religion leads to materialism (like believing that material things, money, sex, etc. are the ways to true happiness when they are in fact not such at all.).</p>
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